Hi Jake,

Sorry to give you bad news, but, hey, you've got those three exciting and beautiful beads to console yourself with! This jade piece is not so much a reproduction or a fake as a modern fantasy based on archaistic Chinese forms. These pieces can be quite pretty in their own right, but what I dislike about them is that they mess up the feel of the original stone with their fake weathering. A good modern carving with no pretense of antiquity would be much nicer to have.

I wouldn't recommend the Chicochai business to anyone who wanted to buy authentic items. They also sponsor a discussion group, which is almost worth a visit to see how vitriolic people can get when they're trying to justify and defend their spurious "treasures" (quite the opposite of the BCN, thank heavens!).

Again, sorry; I really love your Greek bead and wish I could see a clearer picture of it.

All the best,

Will

I also have a jade piece with the weird whitish fake weathering and it would look far better without it. I am experimenting with grinding/polishing it off so the character of the stone appears. It truly is annoying that the fakers do this.

Just don't buy stuff like these junks!

Have fun
anita
translucentworld.com

"METHOD OF DATING:

Since 1993, Chicochai antiques has offered fine Chinese archaic jade pieces dating from the Neolithic period to the Ching Dynasty. We take great care in ensuring the authenticity of our jade by carefully studying relevant literature on Chinese cultural objects and modern archaeological procedures. At Chicochai, we use several methods to date our jade pieces.

Comparative Study. Firstly, our jade is compared with those shown in recognized publications. The main aspects that we examine include the shape and style of the jade. Through comparison, we may set a general period within which our jade must be from.

Stylistic Referencing. Secondly, if a similar recognized jade is unavailable, we reference its characteristics to other types of art (such as pottery, ceramics, bronze, stone, wood carving and paintings) whose date of origin has been confirmed by the archaeological community. Some of the characteristics we examine include the pieces form, design, shape, and pattern. Again, stylistic consistencies aid us in determining a suitable period for the piece.

Weathering. In addition to these two methods, we also assess the degree of weathering on the piece to confirm its estimated date. Jade purity, density, and storage environment are factors we consider when determining the extent of the jades alteration. By examining the degree of weathering in conjunction with the above two methods, we can provide a confident assessment of the pieces date of origin.

Though we take effort to ensure the accuracy of our dating procedure, no dating technique can provide absolute certainty. The certificate of authenticity we have provided is our best estimate based on three generations of accumulated field knowledge and over a decade of committed professional experience collecting fine Chinese jade?"

Chicochai sell nothing but acid treated counterfeit and replica products from Factory in Guandong Province, China, sole agent is in Hong Kong called Skylink Museum, a fake jade dealer on eBay, supplied to Canada (Edmund Lei) and Australia (Trish Wilson).

Their trick is to say that "museum jades are fake, re-polished, and clean..our products are real deal!!!.....to unaware collectors.....buyer beware!!!

*These people destroy image of Hong Kong as "NO FAKE GUARANTEE" city.*

If you need lawsuits and supporting evidence to get your money back, pls feel free to contact me.

Pls read.

JADE - FORGERY AND FRAUD
http://www.translucentworld.com/forum/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=5&start=25

Hi jake, everyone,

In contrast to the ugliness of the way the stone is treated in so many of these imitation- archaic jade carvings, I've been thinking about the sheer pleasure that comes from handling the real thing. That's one of the main reasons why jade has occupied a preeminent place in Chinese culture for at least six millennia - it's a handling material par excellence - and why it has come to be associated with virtue and purity. So there's something particularly nasty about how the stone gets messed up in these modern fakes. (It's not really just a recent phenomenon; in the Ming dynasty when there was a fashion for archaistic objects among the new merchant class, jade carvings were frequently burnt to imitate ancient oxidization, or altering, as it's called.)

Anyway, I thought I'd take a few pictures to try to give a sense of the pleasure that there is in authentic jade surfaces and the ways in which skilled carvers used this hard stone so fluidly. Unfortunately, I'm still just as bad at taking close-up as I always have been, so these pictures give just a faint impression of what I wanted to communicate. But here they are - with apologies and good intentions.

The first one shows the surface of a Hongshan jade which dates to the fourth millennium BCE. The second is a corner of a lovely cong from the Zhou dynasty, mid-first millennium BCE. By that point the cong, which had been a ritual object possibly used in divination, had become purely decorative.

Will

Ancient jade has become almost prohibitively expensive in recent years. Once upon a time, however, I bought a bag of Han dynasty (2,000 year old) jades in a pawnshop in Macau (Macau was and is a gambler's mecca so there are lots of pawnshops!). They cost me less than $20. Here's the only one I still have - it's the tip or finial of something or other and a lovely piece of stone, oxidized in part, with a beautiful patina.

The second picture is of a Zhou dynasty white jade carving of a cowrie shell; it was still easily affordable when I bought it a couple of years ago from Bob Reis, the coin dealer and expert on pretty much everything.

Will

Again, I want to emphasize that the pleasure lies in the way the carver works the surface and the structure of the stone. Though ancient carvers used "primitive" tools they achieved polished surfaces that you never find in the modern fakes (just think of that Hongshan piece, for instance). And when they carved a line, though it may have taken days to incise, they weren't satisfied until it looked as though it was carved in a single cut. Here's a close-up of the "swoosh" on a Han dynasty cicada; see how the line looks so effortless when it's actually the result of endless grinding and polishing. There's some nice oxidization biting into it, too.

And finally, another nice jade from more recent times - the Qing dynasty, eighteenth century. Ten years or so ago, Sotheby's were auctioning off a number of small jades from the Alsdorf collection, and it seemed like too good an opportunity to miss (the prices were about a tenth of what they would be today just ten years later). I bought several pieces and gave most of them away; the one I kept is of a cat and a kitten, beautifully carved with a more advanced technology but still recognizably in the same tradition as the Hongshan piece more than 5,000 years before.

What unites them all, I think, is the respect of the carver for the stone - look at how the Qing carving incorporates the russet tinge into the overall composition. You just don't find that -ever - in the reproductions.

Cheers,

Will

Hi will,

Your enthusiasm for jade is deliciously infectious.

I would raise a few points.

In terms of antiquity, and particularly in China, "jade" refers to nephrite—and that is the stone most admired and revered by the Chinese. (This joy is not limited to them, since nephrite was also enjoyed by North and South Americans, New Zealanders, and Western Asians.)

When we contrast ancient jades to modern "jades," the waters grow muddy, because of language issues and the practice of (now) calling MANY stones "jade." Sometimes these are cultural differences, but sometimes it is a convenient way to rationalize the sale of a lesser material—to elevate it to have some respect. Some modern carvings are jade and some are not.

(I won't go into jadeite, nor the issues of "yu" here.)

You mention that in the Ming Dynasty, there was a fad for reproducing the surface effects of earlier jade pieces. This is, of course, a phenomenon that has continued to today. But an important consideration is that by Ming times, artisans copied THE STYLE of jade carvings—meaning subject matter, and types of carving and decoration (in addition to trying to enhance the appearance of greater age). This likewise continues to be practiced.

Thus, we find there are Ming Dynasty (and later) copies of particular objects from earlier Dynasties—that circulate and confound collectors. Sometimes, we have to say, "this is a Ching (Qing) Dynasty carving imitating a Ming piece," and the like.

The recent pseudo-archaic beads/pendants that have circulated over the past (approximately) ten years are another kettle of fish, but are part and parcel of a longer phenomenon.

Jamey

i myself focusing on neolithic jadeware
and i do want to see more pics of the hongshan ware and cong you have posted
thanks in advance

you can send it to my mailbox

thanks again

Hi Jamey,

Yes, it's a fascinating topic. There ought to be a good book about the history of copying in China, but unfortunately, to the best of my knowledge, there isn't. Historically, it's tied into the deep Chinese appreciation and respect for the past - a desire to do something as well as one's forefathers did. But that tips very easily into the capacity to deceive and defraud - at which point the respectful imitation becomes a fake or forgery.

Sometimes these different potentials can be present in one and the same person. Zhang Daqian, who's probably the greatest Chinese painter of the twentieth century, set out to learn from the techniques and styles of his ancestors. He painted copies and then new versions of the originals, then realised that he could make a lot of money selling them to the most prestigious museums in the West - places like the British Museum and the Boston Museum of Fine Arts. Later those museums began to panic when technical analyses proved their acquisitions suspect, but now those same fakes are actually worth more as paintings by Zhang Daqian than they would be as Yuan or Ming originals.

But most copyists and forgers merely hide in the shadows of the original. That's the case with the Ming period artisans who tried to produce copies of archaic, mainly Han, jade for a new merchant class that wanted status symbols from the past. I'll attach a picture of one of these fakes, a jade sword chape. When I got it a long time ago in Hong Kong, most collectors and quite a few dealers believed these pieces to be genuinely from the Han dynasty. But I was fortunate to have a close friend who was in the process of training himself to become the foremost curator of Chinese art of the last half century, and he pointed out the stylistic differences between the carving of the qilong dragons on my piece and the way they would have flowed slightly more fluidly, even daringly, on the original. Then we met an old dealer who explained some of the techniques, including burning, that had been used to create the so-called "chicken bone" effect of calcification. Nowadays, these things, which were clearly intended to deceive and which still appear occasionally at auction as "Han", are of course worth just as much as any other piece of Ming jade. Probably there are now fakes being made of them!

The second image is of another Han-style sword chape, which I guess must have probably been made in the mid-Qing dynasty - 18th century. Some knowledgeable people who've seen it believe it truly is Han. I think the carving is just too loose, too lazy, for that, though it's quite convincing under a high-powered loupe. Perhaps a Han carver on a bad day, says one of my friends, but for the moment I'm sticking with Qing. I can't say if it is a fake, because I'm not sure it was intended to deceive or if, on the contrary, it was a very carefully made imitation. At this distance, perhaps the distinction doesn't matter very much.

Cheers,

Will

The second pair of pictures raises a slightly different question. Both pieces were made in the Han dynasty. They are carvings of pigs, intended to be placed in the fist of a relative who was being buried, a symbol of plenty for the deceased's existence in the afterlife. They're both about 10 cms in length. The first is jade, but the second is made of some soft stone (calcite possibly). When it was first carved it probably looked quite similar to the jade pig, but 2,000 years in the ground have left it looking a bit worn and shabby? Now, the question is: is the calcite pig a fake? Was it intended to deceive, either the other mourners, or even the dead ancestor? Or was it simply a replacement that was still piously given?

(Interestingly - I've never seen it mentioned - almost all these pigs have tiny suspension holes in the tail - I've no idea why.)

Will

Just a couple more.

The first is a jade hound. These became quite popular as objects with the renewal of jade carving in the round during the Song dynasty (about a thousand years ago). They continued to be made well into the Ming dynasty. The one I'm posting here comes from the end of that process (though, again, I've seen virtually identical ones selling at auction as Song, and therefore for five times as much). The Song dogs are more expressive generally, and finer. This is not so much the case of a later carver copying an earlier original, as it is of a traditional subject gradually losing its vitality. It's still quite a nice little dog.

And finally, here is the only modern fake I have. It's a version of a Hongshan mask-form pendant from 5,000+years ago. I bought it on a trip to Shaanxi in the 90s. I got it, without having to bargain very hard, for about $50. It's quite nicely made, nice material, nice calcification, quite nice carving if you don't look too closely, but at just over 20 cm in length it's way too big, and it simply feels all wrong because there's no real patina at all. A couple of years later I found a dealer in California who had a virtually identical fake on his/her website for $3,200 (which would be a ridiculously good price if it were authentic). I use mine as a wind chime, and every time I hear it I wonder who bought the one in California.

Cheers,

Will

PS Sorry, the Hongshan-style mask pendant has come out upside down. I've tried flipping it, but it refuses to stay the right way up. I don't understand computers at all!

Hello Will,

From "Jade, the Ultimate Treasure of Ancient China" (A catalog of a Canadian exhibit by The Canadian Foundation for the Preservation of
Chinese Cultural and Historical Treasures and China Cultural Relics
Coordination Centre). Chapter 4 Jade Burial Objects of the Feudal Lords of the Han Dynasty and their Origin:

"Before the middle period of the Western Han dynasty, there were two types of hand-held funerary objects: one was the jade arch-shaped object
(huang), and the other was the jade xie or pointed pendant. However, the
most common type is the jade pig which appeared mostly after the Eastern Han dynasty. . . . Small holes were drilled at both ends of the jade pig to allow thread to pass through, so that the object could be held in or tied to the hands of the dead." p.112

Terry

Dear RM,

We all have to be careful what we say, and how we say it.

This is a public forum, where opinions are expressed, and where anyone is welcome to share an opinion.

However, things work best when the topic is the beads, and not directed at a person. Rather than say 'your opinion is wrong,' why not share YOUR perspective? Keep an open mind. You may find YOUR opinion to be changing.

Let's indulge in dialogue, and let's all be respectful of each other.

Sincerely, Jamey

Hi, RM,

I'll wait to hear more from you. All the best,

Will

I try not to involve in big discussion so I make my statement short but not to mean any offense to anyone. I use the wrong word "understanding" maybe,¡¡I actually mean I can not totally agree with your Judgement on the pieces you showd.

I really love to read your posts here though it is always too long for me and some I could not fully understand, I still could see your great knowledge on chinese history and love of chinese culture, I would like to share with you and all the forumees my experiences on ancient chinese jadeware later (where is my english -chinese dictionary) in which I started to be interested when I was 25 many many years ago...

at last The forum is a good place for all beads lovers and for me a good place for such an old man to practice english and to make its brain going on.

All my best

R.M.

Thanks, R.M, for such an elegant and generous reply. And such a lengthy one, too; if you carry on like this, you'll soon be as long-winded as I am! Hopefully one of these days when I'm next in China, we'll have the chance to drink some tea and argue about jade together.

Very best wishes,

Will

Hmmmmm
I would highly recommend some chinese marrons glaces...

I am an ignoramus when it comes to Jade, I have cut Jade using diamond, it is actually pretty hard to get a decent polish, I respect all of the craftsmen that create their little wonders with Jade.....I just don't like the new stuff sold as original old antiques, etc....thank you Will for your insights!!!

I have never seen jade sword chape in this shape, neither genuine one nor reproduction/fake.

The matrix of the stone you post look similar to acid treated soap stone. Any hardness test result?

Have fun
anita
translucentworld.com

I have never seen jade sword chape in this shape, neither genuine one nor reproduction/fake.

The matrix of the stone you post look similar to acid treated soap stone. Any hardness test result?

Have fun
anita
translucentworld.com

I have never seen jade sword chape in this shape, neither genuine one nor reproduction/fake.

The matrix of the stone you post look similar to acid treated soap stone. Any hardness test result?

Have fun
anita
translucentworld.com

Hello Jake,

I have to say that I, with some sorrow, have come around to Will's view of the age of a good portion of Chicochai's jades. Sorrow not because I bought and sold many of these jades believing that they were actually ancient although that is reason for some regret. The hardest part is letting go of the seductive idea that these sometimes quite beautiful and sometimes humorous or charming small pendants are very old or ancient.

Nevertheless, I am going to stick my neck out here (at the risk of getting my head chopped off) and defend what I see as the virtues and pleasures of "Chicochai quality jades." (i.e., jades which like those carefully chosen by Edmund Lei of Chicochai, have been selectively culled by Chicochai and a few other jade galleries as well from the thousands and thousands available in China). So, as an aside, part of what I am saying here is that I can well believe that your friends have "good taste."

The nephrite jade from which all of the "neolithic era" jades are made is often beautifully colored and marked. (One can't always say neolithic or Hongshan style jades, because many of the designs are fantasy pieces inspired by a notion of the neolithic aesthetic or sometimes invented out of whole cloth.) Because they are true jade and many of them are smooth and well -"carved," they lend themselves to the ages-old pleasures of touch: Some of them nicely fit the contours of the hand. Some jades which I wear or handle frequently become more and more translucent over time. Body heat can make them glow from within.

Most interesting to me and a subject which deserves much more attention, is the fact that some of these copies, fakes, imitations, CREATIONS are unique and engaging rather than cookie-cutter mass-productions. The Hongshan style -- or what was thought to be Hongshan- swept the world by storm. I know that I was caught up in the wave of enthusiasm for the neolithic which was inspired by the twentieth centuries discoveries of the Hongshan and Liangzhu cultures among others. Here was something fresh and new -- totally unlike the classical Han and post-Han motifs which had been copied ad infinitum to the point where all the life had been drained out of them. I believe that in many cases the makers themselves have been inspired by the Hongshan aesthetic. I would guess that all discoveries of a new aesthetic are accompanied by small, local flurries of creativity
until what is "new" through over-exposure, becomes old and tired. (As has been mentioned, this has happened again and again in China. Similarly, we've seen various periods of Egyptian revival and certainly the Japonisme of the late 19th century in France and elsewhere would qualify as an example.) Of course I am not equating new fantasy productions with actual true expressions of the original culture. There is no such comparison to be made. I am merely making the case that some recent jades are certainly as interesting and beautiful as many of the lifeless and and stultified productions of the Qing and perhaps earlier. (Of course, again, there are beautiful Qing jades, that is not the point.)

Here are some of my favorite necklaces.

Terry

The zhulong variation is a lovely blue/gray/green jade similar to the color of some Central American Pre-Columbian jadeite. A sphinx-like fantasy.

Chicochai sell nothing but acid treated counterfeit and replica products from Factory in Guandong Province, China, sole agent is in Hong Kong called Skylink Museum, a fake jade dealer on eBay, supplied to Canada (Edmund Lei) and Australia (Trish Wilson).

Their trick is to say that "museum jades are fake, re-polished, and clean..our products are real deal!!!.....to unaware collectors.....buyer beware!!!

*These people destroy image of Hong Kong as "NO FAKE GUARANTEE" city.*

If you need lawsuits and supporting evidence to get your money back, pls feel free to contact me.

Pls read.

JADE - FORGERY AND FRAUD
http://www.translucentworld.com/forum/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=5&start=25

Chicochai sell nothing but acid treated counterfeit and replica products from Factory in Guandong Province, China, sole agent is in Hong Kong called Skylink Museum, a fake jade dealer on eBay, supplied to Canada (Edmund Lei) and Australia (Trish Wilson).

Their trick is to say that "museum jades are fake, re-polished, and clean..our products are real deal!!!.....to unaware collectors.....buyer beware!!!

*These people destroy image of Hong Kong as "NO FAKE GUARANTEE" city.*

If you need lawsuits and supporting evidence to get your money back, pls feel free to contact me.

Pls read.

JADE - FORGERY AND FRAUD
http://www.translucentworld.com/forum/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=5&start=25

This neolithic fantasy of a ram-bird is particularly dear to me. It is made from a beautiful dark green spinach jade.

A small disk with preying mantises. There are two fine monkey heads on the bead.

I know that I have more and better examples of this, but I'm dealing with old photos -- some of which are too dark and of poor quality as you have seen -- and I cannot find everything I'm looking for. Perhaps later.

Winged man, animal holding a cicada.

An "art-deco" "Hongshan" and a very sculptural bead.

glossy larva

It's a fake, carved from altered stone.

Chicochai sell nothing but acid treated counterfeit and replica products from Factory in Guandong Province, China, sole agent is in Hong Kong called Skylink Museum, a fake jade dealer on eBay, supplied to Canada (Edmund Lei) and Australia (Trish Wilson).

Their trick is to say that "museum jades are fake, re-polished, and clean..our products are real deal!!!.....to unaware collectors.....buyer beware!!!

*These people destroy image of Hong Kong as "NO FAKE GUARANTEE" city.*

If you need lawsuits and supporting evidence to get your money back, pls feel free to contact me.

Pls read.

JADE - FORGERY AND FRAUD
http://www.translucentworld.com/forum/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=5&start=25

They are acid treated fakes.

Not Tang, the horse is in Ming Style copied from horse running in water of the work of Chou Meng Fu, a famous painter of the Yuan Dynasty.

That style of running horse in water was popular in the Ming Dynasty, you can see from Ming Dynasty roof tile, and stone carving displayed at Louyang Museum.

The dragon is in the Ming style also. However, they are all acid treated FAKE. The dragon s possible serpentine, not jade. You can use iron to scratch it, it will leave marks on that junk.

Have fun

Anita
translucentworld.com

We all would agree that it is not a good thing to represent items as being ancient or antique when they are not. That's an easy one. I believe that Edmund Lei launched the jade discussion forum in good faith and that he truly hoped it would be an educational arena
(that it proved otherwise is an artifact of human nature, not his intentions.) I visited him once at his home in Vancouver and the family members were genuinely enthusiastic about and proud of their personal collection of jades, many of them similar to those they sold. I do not think that their "Method of Dating" cited by Fred was bogus or meant to mislead -- at least not initially. I could be wrong, but this is my reading of the situation. There are still collectors in China who have published books of their collections of "Hongshan" jades, jades very similar to some of those shown above. The fact that they believe in the age and authenticity of these "Hongshan" pieces would suggest that it is not impossible that he, too, was caught up in the excitement of the chase in the 1980's and 1990's, The jades in question, their makers and the motives of those who sold them have often been simplified, vilified and caricatured out of all recognition.

Hi Terry,

I must say I find it very hard to believe that somebody could sell hundreds, perhaps thousands of such pieces to a large number of buyers over a period of years without bothering to find out exactly where they came from. A trip to any good museum of Asian or Chinese art ought to have made anyone immediately suspicious. A very large amount of money was made out of these things, and uninformed buyers will go on paying the price for years to come.

Cheers,

Will

Hi Will,

I am hearing you say that it is greater negligence for a dealer to sell -than a buyer to collect- misrepresented antiques. It is my observation that anyone who has been in the antiques market for a short period of time knows that he must do his homework. As you have no doubt observed, even the top museums and auctions houses are making mistakes and almost everybody knows it. Students of art must pay for their education. The negligence is comparative.

Sincerely,
FRED

I can't help but to add this:
Let's do some research into the minds of the myriad of such buyers, all around the World, for so many years...
We will not find there innocent minds only, but also(often?)the cunning schemes of clever-that-you antiques hunters instead. They (we) have experienced orgasms at purchasing from an uneducated seller, for a two figure dollar price, a thousands-worth neolithic Jade treasury! He, he.

I am totally with you on this one, Nishedha. Twice I have handled these "Han" and "Neolithic" style pieces when I have clearly explained to the customer that "there was a great deal of doubt as to the authenticity of these jade sculptures and these were new copies". I priced them based upon their beauty alone, about forty dollars each. And then the collectors chose to purchase them with the speculative idea that they would make a huge profit. They were wishfully thinking that I was wrong and they would make an instant killing. If you need to make a profit -or just get your money back- you had better stick to what you know about. But, if you can afford an education in antique beads, I would advise you to experiment. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we-w-r6uUHI

Hello terry

Thanks for posting the pictures and expressing your thoughts. Sorry you were disappointed on some aspects. I hope you will continue to love jade and continue to discover the wonder, mystery and sometimes the fantasy of archaic jade.

By the way I am not sure if you have visited the Gary Lee Todd website of Chinese museums. It covers a wide range of museums in China including Henan, Shaanxi, Sanxindui, Yinxiu and also Shanghai Museum Jade Gallery etc.etc. Among other artefacts exhibited you will find archaic jade items from Xizhou, Shang and Hongshan.

Here is the link:

http://picasaweb.google.com/GaryLeeTodd

sallie

Beautiful pictures and wise words on collecting all around. Both buyers and collectors share responsibility. But in the end, it boils down to a few important questions:

Do you love it?
And what is it worth TO YOU.

Any time I've gotten in trouble for purchasing ANYTHING, it was when I thought I was making a savvy investment or thought I was going to make a killing $$$.

Any time I've purchased for love of the object for what it is--be it rare, ancient, modern, "collectible", authentic, a copy, or even silly (ask me about my collection of animal flower pots from the 40's & 50's!)--I have never been disappointed. Sometimes I even pay a lot more than I KNOW the object is worth, just because....it speaks to me. For some unfathomable uniquely human reason, I just have to have it. (Of course, the pocketbook eventually has to override the more extravagant "have to have it" decisions!) :^)

I know that doesn't make me knowledgeable or respected collector. But that's how I collect, and I'm satisfied. :^)

Chicochai sell nothing but acid treated counterfeit and replica products from Factory in Guandong Province, China, sole agent is in Hong Kong called Skylink Museum, a fake jade dealer on eBay, supplied to Canada (Edmund Lei) and Australia (Trish Wilson).

Their trick is to say that "museum jades are fake, re-polished, and clean..our products are real deal!!!.....to unaware collectors.....buyer beware!!!

*These people destroy image of Hong Kong as "NO FAKE GUARANTEE" city.*

If you need lawsuits and supporting evidence to get your money back, pls feel free to contact me.

Pls read.

JADE - FORGERY AND FRAUD
http://www.translucentworld.com/forum/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=5&start=25

This is acid treated fake jade from Chicochai. It's for tourist.

Please visit below link to understand more about Chicochai and their fake jade business. The Chicochai website was closed down and the gang moved to different website to talk about their acid treated fake antique jade supplied by Skylink Museum of FAKE, Hong Kong.

JADE - FORGERY AND FRAUD
http://www.translucentworld.com/forum/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=5